Ed Harrold and Mike Maher discuss breath facilitation, the evolving breathwork field, and the responsibility of guiding practice for others.
Ed Harrold with Mike Maher. Originally published on YouTube December 8, 2023. Watch the original conversation on YouTube.
Ed Harrold and Mike Maher discuss breath facilitation, the evolving breathwork field, and the responsibility of guiding practice for others.
00:14.1 Welcome back, everyone. My name's Eddie Harrold. Welcome to my Life with Breath expert series. This week I have the amazing honor of hosting Mike Marr, who is at the forefront of this new wave of, of breath facilitators that are moving throughout the world. And Mike came in, uh, in the kind of the Wim Hof phase, uh, of the breath, and, you know, that's where Mike first got going with it. But he has this podcast called Take a Deep Breath, and I think it's the number one, uh, YouTube podcast, uh, in the world. Mike has hundreds of thousands of subscribers, and I'm really excited to share our conversation with, with Mike today.
01:01.0 So welcome, Mike. Oh, thanks, Ed. What a beautiful, uh, introduction, and, um, yeah, thank you. Um, you know, it's funny you just said about the new wave of instructors. There is a... There is already another wave- Yeah ... and I'm already feeling like the old kid on the block as I'm seeing all these new guys and gals hit the streets with their HD cameras on the beach and in the mountains filming these beautiful breathwork exercises. Um, but yeah, if... So just, yeah, just, just tickled me when you said that. Well, you know, the only one old here is me. So I know there's a lot going on in your life, and, and to really maximize the time and the conversation we're gonna share, let's just have a little centering and, uh, bring ourselves together,
01:40.2 and then we'll dive into whatever the universe wants us to speak about. Perfect. So if we could all just kind of sit up tall in our spine, anchor our awareness down into our lower body, and, and just feel safe from our feet to our buttock, and our buttock through the belly. Opening this huge chest of ours, letting go of any insecurity or self-sabotage thinking. And if it feels right, just let your eyes close, release and relax your low jaw, and allow the tongue to rest on the upper palate. If you want to control your breath, great. If you don't want to, that's great. Your body knows how to breathe on its own.
02:26.5 And as you begin to notice the breath coming in and out of your body, see if you can practice self-observation without judgment, without labeling. See if you can stretch a little more air in and a little more air out. Just imagine for the next space of time in your life that it would be impossible to be negative. It would be impossible to be angry. It would be impossible to host a thought form or memory that didn't come from our heart. And transitioning from the surface mind into the deeper mind, a place of deep remembering and knowing, a place of teaching and listening. Notice your breath knows exactly where to go right now at this moment of your life.
04:13.9 How does it do that? How does it know that? I'm in the United States, Mike's in the UK, and we're connected. Two brothers becoming one. And what does it feel like to observe ourselves without judging ourselves, knowing that each time we judge ourselves, we break our own heart? Finding a space in your chest intuitively where you feel really comfortable, regardless of your story or what you're wearing or what's in your bank account. Mike, you wanna f- you wanna lead a few rounds of breathing here? Oh, yeah. Beautiful. Yeah. So just continue- Dive in, brother. Thank you. So, yeah, just, um, stay within your, your space.
05:49.4 Just start to pay attention to the slightly cooler air as it comes in through the nose or mouth, and slightly warmer air on the exhale. And I'm a really big fan of the, the bow and arrow breath. Sometimes conscious connected circular breath. But just this idea of pulling back that bow, really filling everything up, belly, chest, but taking your time. So really slowly, gently inhaling in. And then when you're full and the last molecule of air is in just a complete relax, almost letting go of that bow and arrow. So really take your time. How slow and deep can you go? And then completely relaxing the exhale.
06:45.0 And on the inhale when we're going nice and slow, really take a moment to savor as you draw in the energy, as you draw in the breath. Almost like a fine wine or a chocolate. And as we do the completely relaxed exhale, look at each exhale as another opportunity to relax a little deeper, giving yourself permission to let go and relax a little more. Just do a few more with me. And we'll do one more. Really let this one count now. So really savor, really drawing in the air, filling up, bringing that last molecule. And then when we let go, let's do a little sigh.
07:44.7 Let all that energy out. Ah. That feels good. Thank you, Ed. Back to you. Oh, Mike. So in a moment we're gonna open our eyes. Just take another moment in the inner world and fill every cell of your body with self-love. And fill every cell of your body with self-kindness and self-generosity, joy. 'Cause we know these work. And when you're ready to leave the meditation, slowly open your eyes. Wow. Works every time. Beautiful. Thank you so much. Thanks so much for taking some time out of your, your busy schedule to connect with us here. That's my pleasure. I can't wait to get stuck in. I've been looking forward to this 'cause I think you've been on...
08:47.8 I think we've done three interviews now if I'm correct. Um, so it's gonna be, it's gonna be interesting flipping the tables around a little bit now on the conversation. Yeah, I had the honor of being on, on Mi- show several times, and, you know, Mike is an amazing host. And not only that, now he's become an amazing facilitator. In fact, Mike and I are both on The Breath Source, which is a, a new app that has a ton of science and application and breath experiences and trainings that it's taken over the world. What do you think about being on that app together, Mike? Thank you.
09:23.5 I, yeah, no, I love it. I, I, I, I love the fact that, yeah, you're on there, that we've got all these beautiful breathwork instructors, some of them quite well known, some of them on the way up. Um, but what, what re- I'm really attracted to as a, a user, let alone being on there, is just, like, you've just got, like, this world of breathwork. A- a- and I keep calling them, like, all these different flavors, and so it's like some people might like the flavor of, of Ed's breathwork or mine or, or Dan or, you know, whoever it, it is. But because it's all in this curated app and people have gone through this process of getting into the app, you've got really lovely quality.
09:58.7 So yeah, so I, I, I think it's really important l- part of the breathwork scene. Um, and it's only just getting started, which is really cool. Yeah. There's a, there's a ton of great talent. Everybody's positive and optimistic that, you know, we can turn this thing around, you know? Mm. As, as a species globally, you know, we're at kind of at a tipping point where, like- Mm ... what, what's it gonna be? Is it gonna be love and acceptance, or is it gonna be fear and anger? And y- you know, the breath has, you know, been used for thousands of years to move away from negative states of consciousness, and now it's in an app form where we can really
10:38.8 spread the, the wings and the branches a little wider than we could 20 years ago. Yeah. Yeah, beautiful. So what is it like having the number one breath podcast in YouTube i- in the world? Y- you know, I d- I, I try not to think about it too much. Um, we- we're about two weeks away from ... We're on track to hit 200,000, um, beautiful souls in about two weeks. We're at 198 at the minute, and it, um, after a while, the numbers just, you know, it just ... I mean, w- I, I remember when it got to 1,000, it just blew me away. I was like, "How have 1,000 people have hit subscribe?" Um, but I, I've talked about this a little bit before actually.
11:22.9 I really just focus on, um, having a good conversation. Similar to you, I'm sure. Um, I try not to let the numbers, um, influence anything. Um, try to stay away from the comments as, as much as possible. Uh, you know, sometimes I'll respond to a few things, but really it's, um, I just wanna have the best conversations with the best people a- and, and deliver value. A- and um, the last bit on that is, very selfishly, uh, it's about my learning as well. That, that ... And it's like whatever's interesting to me. Um, and so I've had the, the great fortune of speaking to so many wonderful human beings, and to have them for a couple of hours, you know, read their book, speak to them before we hit record, after we hit record, uh, make some
12:07.1 connections like we've done. Um, so pff, what, what a gift. So, so really it's, it's almost driven through that. I'm trying to learn a lot more. Um, and it's ... And, and whenever I've deviated from that, if I've tried to do something that's, say, a little bit clickbaity or ... It's never done as well. But whenever it's come from- Yeah ... that good place of I want to learn, I ... Like, I had, I had a guy on a little while ago called The Breathing Diabetic. Fascinating. His name's Nick Heath. I was like, "I really wanna know everything that's going on here." Great podcast. I was so, uh, eager to talk to him.
12:40.1 I had so many questions. I geeked out so much, and it's one of the best performing podcasts this year. And I was like, there must be, there must be a coincidence there in my passion and, and whereas some of them I've maybe gone for somebody that's got, like, a lot of subscribers or something like that, they've not done as well. And so I think, I think people can feel it when you're really connected and, and you're having that good conversation. So I don't really let the numbers, um, the subscribers really dictate too much now. It's like, how can I have a really fricking good conversation and learn something?
13:07.7 Well, you've had some huge, huge names on there. E- everybody in the field, you know, whether it's, you know, science-based or pranayam-based or, you know, indigenous cultures and shamanism. You know, it's, it ... This stuff's been around for a really, really long time. And, and now we're beginning to see that it can be wedged seamlessly into just about any human platform for health or wellness, performance, drug addiction- Mm-hmm ... uh, any types of the negative, lower emotions. You've had some great people on there. Has there been any highlights that, any light bulbs that have gone off in your head over the years where you were like, "Wow"?
13:46.9 Oh, well, I, I would say that nine out of 10 of them I feel like that. I'm like, "Oh, sugar, that's, that's amazing," or, um ... And I, and I always ... And it's not all about the breath. It's, like, 90% breath, and then the rest is, like, wellness, spirituality, and, and a few other bits and bobs. Or maybe 80, 80% breath, and then the ... Yeah. I leave a little bit of space for, like, say, indigenous cultures or I'm obsessed with hunter-gatherers and how we used to live and ancestral living- Mm-hmm ... and stuff. But yeah. Or what, what comes to mind? I'll tell you, I've just, um ...
14:16.8 The podcast that's gonna be coming out this week is with a guy, um, called Lawrence Blair, and him and his brother in the '70s did a 10-year documentary series called Ring of Fire. Mm-hmm. Incredible. It's one of the best things I've ever seen. They were living with pirates in the '70s, and they had a couple of cameras. This is the '70s and '80s. There's no phones. Um, they've got batteries and a limited tape, and they're making this docu- And they, and they're out with pirates for months. For months eating gruel, living in the hull of the ship with cockroaches. And then they went to all these places, and they lived with cannibals and everything.
14:51.5 But the reason I was really intrigued in these guys, there's this clip on YouTube. Um, think what you, uh ... You know, people can take this with a pinch of salt, but, um, they in- they found a qigong master in Indonesia in, I think, the '80s. And they went to him because they were ... One of the people's having problems with their eye, and so he went to do some work. And he was doing, uh, needlework. And he was able to deliver a little bit of an electric charge to the needle through his hand, and they were getting like electric shocks. And he goes, "I'm not doing anything special here.
15:21.7 It's just like what an electric eel does." And you see on the camera how he starts touching people on their tummy or on, um, the hand, and they're getting like these electric shocks. Um, anyway, fast-forward to a little bit later in the documentary, they're saying, "This guy's got other abilities." And he scrunches up a piece of newspaper, and he makes it catch fire. And I'm like, "What the hell have I just seen? Is it real? Is it fake?" So this guy came on, and he, he, he was one of the brothers that made this film. Um, so he... I just wanted to know what was going on, who was this guy.
15:50.5 Um, so that's a bit more of the esoteric, spiritual, woo-woo stuff. Um, but yeah, uh, there's, there's so much more. Yeah, these qigong guys, they have all this chi right here. Yeah. And they can do amazing healing where they really blend spirit and science. It's remarkable what they can do with consciousness. Mm. Yeah. It's been around a while. Yes. A- a- and I think from what I'm gathering as well, it... most of them w- you'll never hear about it because a l- like for example, I had a guy on recently, um, from White Tiger Qigong, and when we went to film the interview, he turned his camera off.
16:35.9 And I was like, "What's going on here?" He goes, "I can't show my face. I've taken an oath not to become famous." So that was quite cool, actually, so we carried on with the interview. But, um, I think especially the most popular... or not popular, the, the real masters, I think we, you... we'll probably never hear about them because they've taken these oaths. They're not meant to get famous. Um, they're doing things probably in their local community. They're probably not on YouTube or Instagram. Um, and, and, and I think a lot of it might get lost or it's passed... I don't know. It's, it's, it's a very interesting area.
17:05.3 You know, I'd love to go... This, this particular guy, um, the one that was doing the fire stuff, he, he's passed away now. Um, and what the, the, the White Tiger Qigong, uh, guy was saying to me was he had a lot of liver problems, and liver was a, uh... the liver's associated with fire, and if we use too much of the fire energy, it burns the liver out. And so he was kind of saying that there might be something here, and, um, this guy was maybe showing off a little bit and, and a few other bits. And so, um, I think we're very lucky that we've got that captured, and I think, oh, what if humanity could get hold of this information and they're able to do it more?
17:38.2 And then another part of me goes, "Would it be misused?" Most likely, but there'd be a lot of healing at the same time. It's that balance, isn't it? It's like we invented- Yeah ... planes, and then, you know, 30 years later, we're dropping bombs on people through those planes. So it's that, that, uh, duality, isn't it, of any, any, any, uh, gift we have. Yeah. It's- Quite a dance these days, isn't it? Mm-hmm. Now, besides the amazing global podcast that you have and, and the amazing guests that you've had over the past few years, you know, I, I know that you also are involved in some other things.
18:11.1 Uh, some other programs and trainings and, I mean, you get, you get around. You know, what's going on in your life right now? Ah. So I became a father 11 months ago. So that in itself- Congratulations ... thank you, has been the best thing that has ever happened to me. Like, the best thing. Like, nothing compares. Like, I cannot give you any other, um, thing that even comes close. It's been the hardest thing as well. I think they say you lose 700 hours sleep in the first year, so that's true. There you go. I think I'm, I'm probably close to thou- 1,000. Um, but interestingly, what's come with that is a lot of stress.
18:49.4 A lot of stress, financial worry. Like, I quit my day job to, to do this full time, so I'm a full-time breath coach since my son was born. Um, and then a lot of stress has come through that because of the responsibility and, and everything else. And interestingly, before he re- hit record we were, we called you and I were talking about this. And then with the stress has come a lot of shame 'cause, oh, hang on, I'm a breath coach. I shouldn't be stressed. So I've been dealing with all that this year, and I've come out the other side of it now. So to answer your question, what's been going on?
19:16.8 I've just come back from your beautiful country. I was in Wyoming. Ah, yeah. My God, beautiful. I didn't get to Yellowstone, which I'm gutted about, but I spent 10 days in Thermopolis, um, in the s- hot springs learning this technique called Vivacion, um, which our mutual friend Tom Granger put me on to. Um, interviewed the, the, the CEO of that, or lineage holder a couple of times, Paul Hughes. Um, and that's really helped me. So I'm gonna ... I'm, I'm sorry I'm bouncing around a little bit here. Before I found breathwork, my stress was probably always around a nine out of 10. I'm a s- I'm a stress head.
19:51.2 I was big into caffeine. I smoked a little bit in my younger years, did some drugs and a few other bits and bobs. Um, but I was very much living on adrenaline and stress, and then w- after the whole Wim Hof thing, I came back and noticed my lungs were very shallow and I was panting and, you know, suddenly started to take control of my breath. And my stress came down pretty quick once I learnt some techniques. Probably got it down to about a three, and it sat- Great ... at around a three, but that became the new baseline. So I've been this kind of guy that's got always got this, I would describe it as like a background radiation of stress.
20:21.4 Not high, but, but low. And but because it's always there and it's chronic, it, it, it can be quite wearing and your resilience then comes down a little bit. Anyway, so I do the breathwork, I'm doing coherence breathing all the time. It's definitely kept it at, at bay. But the interesting thing is coming back from this Vivacion teacher training, I'd say I've got it down to like a 1.5 now with these techniques. Great. It's been... It, it, it felt like the missing, missing piece for me. And I'm happy to, to, to delve into plenty of that, but, um, I would say, like, it, it was a, it was a beautiful 10 days.
20:51.4 I learnt some wonderful things. Um, and, um, yeah, it's, it, it's, it's called the science of happiness, um, or one of the ways it's described. And, um, I never looked at happiness as a skill before, and so now I've been like, "Well, maybe I'm just a bit unhappy sometimes." Like, oh no, you've got to practice. You've got to practice- Yeah ... happiness like everything else. We practice being miserable a lot. So, um, so yeah, that's what's been... That, that's some of it. So becoming a new dad, um, traveling to the US, uh, working on the app with you guys. Um, and then I... And the last bit is I, I work with clients.
21:25.0 So I have a number of, um, clients I take on. I take on four or five a month. Um, and I, and I work very, very, um, from my perspective, very intensely. So I, I build them a program from the ground up. So no two clients have the same program from me. They come to me. I describe the brife- breath as a Swiss Army knife, so I got all these little tools. Right. Love that. No, no, no, no, no tools the same tool for everybody. Some people might need a little screwdriver, some people the scissors, magnifying glass. So my whole, the whole reason I do the podcast, apart from getting to meet all these cool people, is I'm constantly finding new tools for the Swiss Army knife.
21:57.4 And then when I meet a client and they tell me what their desires are, what their goals are, where their breath health is currently, I'll then build them something based on what they need. So yeah, so that's, that's it. So it's, I'm pretty, pretty busy at the minute but, um, yeah, l- loving it. And, and now that I've got the stress down a bit more and I'm practicing the, the skill of happiness, um, it's, yeah, it's, it's, it's really nice. Yeah. It's, it's great when we find value like that, you know, i- inside ourselves and it's been resting there the whole time. Mm-hmm. But, you know, we just kind of missed it.
22:28.4 You know, we, we come out of what I call the, the karma years. You know, it's like 15 to, like, 30, and some hang on a little longer but, you know, you've got all these violations of the law of nature that, you know, we thought we could be different and, and, and it would be okay and we would find happiness. And maybe we did for a couple minutes or a couple weeks or, you know, a year or so but, you know, eventually we just like, "Something's missing." And, you know, you have the kind of like this wake-up period. Mm. And you're like, you know, like you're, you know, you can't really describe it but something, a, a spark or a little light or something
23:09.8 goes off inside us and then we decide to look at ourselves differently, you know? Or we look at the world differently or we look at relationship opportunities differently. And then, you know, then we've got this whole debris field behind us of material, you know, that we need to heal, you know, before we can get down to that stress level of 1.5. Mm. Yeah. Yeah. It, yeah, I almost look at it sometimes almost like leveling up through a computer game. It's like you have to go through that level to get to the next one. So probably wasn't ready for a Vivacion-type thing a couple of years ago.
23:48.1 Um, had to go through the steps I had to go through. Like, even this year I discovered something called, uh, tension release exercises, TRE, with, um, I had Dr. David Berceli on who came up with this. And my body's been doing all this, like, crazy stuff that I think sometimes it's called kriyas, but I've been having all these energetic releases. Kriyas? I've just been going through that process. That's been ... And that, that came at the right time. I had a lot of tension in the diaphragm ... years of what, uh, Belisa Vranich, Dr. Beli- Belisa Vranich calls gut sucking. So I've been, I was sucking that gut in for three decades, you know, trying to hide- Right ...
24:19.6 having a belly. And so s- there's a lot of tension there, literally tension, 'cause it's been tense for four decades. And so as I started going through this trauma release process, I was getting wiggles in my shoulders and, but most, uh, powerfully was the diaphragm just going fricking crazy. G- finally able to move and, and allowing it to move in the way it wanting to move, and it was directing my breath. It was a very interesting thing. But yeah, I feel like we have to level up. So we go, we're go- going through the path of life and all these different things. But yeah, like, you're right, there's the debris field behind us of all the things we have done or should have done or all those different things.
24:54.8 But yeah, it's, um- Oh, yeah ... wonderful ti- it's a wonderful time to be alive. You know, there's so much information out there. Uh, uh, almost too much information, but I feel like such a good... We're so lucky to be alive at this time. I know there's a lot of dark out there. I know there's a lot of challenges going on out there. But nev- I heard this thing the other day saying, you know what, you know, if it was a couple of hundred years ago, maybe a thousand years ago, you had to have a relationship with your priest to even know the Bible. They wouldn't even give you a copy of the Bible.
25:21.0 You know? Right. It wasn't even the language you could understand. That's how much information was controlled. And now, so many podcasts, so many courses, so many books out there, um, from people that have spent their life studying something. It's, um, it's really, really good. There's never been this many people on the planet at one time asking so many questions about who am I, you know? Mm. What is my purpose? You know, why am I here? Mm. Usually, you would just do what your parents did and what your grandparents did before that. You never left your hometown and, you know, there was, you know, if you did that, you were, you know, you were shamed out of the family.
25:56.7 You know, somehow you weren't a good family member. Mm. You know, and I, and, you know, your life's not gonna change. You know, your answers that you give yourself in life aren't gonna change until you change the question. And, you know, when you're stressed out, it's just, "I need answers," you know? You don't, you don't have time to pause and reflect like, "Maybe I'm asking the wrong questions, and I need to change my questions." And that's where this diaphragm comes in. Mm. 'Cause once you start accessing the sensitivity around the upper abdomen, you start accessing the sensitivity in our lower lobes of our lungs, then everything that we're not begins to die.
26:40.5 Mm. And it, it's a b- it's a bumpy ride at first because you, you, because all this stuff's going on in your brain, the microbiome of your gut. But this thing right here, who would've thunk it, is like the ma- master switch, the master key that unlocks everything that was hidden from us or, or locked before. Yeah. Yeah. Incredible muscle, isn't it? It's, um, you know, up until probably the age of 35, I don't think I ever thought about my diaphragm. I don't even know if I even knew what it was. It was- Incredible ... yeah. And, and now it's something I think about every day, you know.
27:19.1 Um, diaphragm health, and flexibility, and strength. I ha- there was this, um, the nu- the numbers are gonna be a little bit rough, but I think it, there's, uh, people might know of something called vital capacity, which is the amount of air you can suck in, and then the amount of air you can blow out, and they measure that. So if you've got one balloon and you, you, you know, you're able to measure that total airflow, that's your, your, your vital capacity. So it's different from lung capacity and, and vol- tidal volume. Um, and I think at the age of 30, um, that, that, let's say that's 80%.
27:48.6 When you get down to, um, the age of 80, I think you've got about 37% of your vital capacity because diaphragm's got weak, uh, muscles have become, um, very, very rigid, and so your, your ribcage has become like a metal birdcage. Your diaphragm has atrophied, and so the muscle's no longer there. Um, so this has just been something very interesting that I've been really working on, on my clients, but also on myself as exercises, and I've learned some from you actually, from our first podcast, how to get all this really, um, flexible. Um, but I believe it's one of the markers that they use to look at for longevity, which is really cool.
28:21.6 Like, how much air can you really shift? Because when you think about a sick, old person, generally if you were to picture that in your mind's eye, normally mouth breath. It's gonna be very shallow, and it's normally fairly quick. When you think about a superhero, normally great posture, stoic, mouth normally closed, deep breaths, hands on the, the hips. And so th- those two images are kind of built into us. Where are they from? Maybe it's from TV and films, but I think we've also got a knowing of what good breathing is. Um, so yeah, diaphragm is, um, very overlooked. It's less overlooked these days, but I think we could all do with improving our diaphragmatic health.
28:59.0 It just seems to be one of those no-brainers. Yeah. I think when we say the diaphragm's a muscle, we really are undervaluing, you know, when we think of a muscle, you know, it's just a muscle around a bone and, you know, the, I look at the diaphragm, the thoracic diaphragm, as an organ. Mm. It has so many different responsibilities. It touches so many other organs. Mm. It has so much to do with balancing our fluids and gases so that we can remain in good rhythm and cycles because, you know, not every day is gonna be, you know, the sun's gonna come out, you know. You know, there's gonna be days where, you know, it, it's gonna be stormy, you know, mentally.
29:41.8 Mm. And they just seem to come out of the blue. But if you have this thing, and you've got a relationship with it, which is really unusual because it doesn't have these sensory nerves like these have. Mm. Like I can pinch my arm, and I can feel I'm pinching my arm. There, there isn't a lot of sensory fascia on it. So you kind of have to get in like a dark room with yourself and begin to notice, okay, this is, I feel something here, or I feel something up here on my exhale, and then you're off on like this journey, uh, into this dark room of all this energy.
30:17.0 Yeah. Yeah. It's, um, so our, our, our mutual connection, Tom Granger, who has, uh, Draw Breath and Aria Breath, um, he interviewed a, a cardiologist called Doc- a cardiologist called Dr. Alan Watkins, and it's a good podcast actually. I'm trying to get him on my podcast at the minute. And, um, he was talking about coherence breathing. And cohe- coherence breathing, one of the many benefits or one of the things that's going on with the coherence breath is we really engage the diaphragm. You know, we're doing this slow rhythmic equal breath. Mm-hmm. Um, some people have called the diaphragm the second heart. You know, it's a, it's a, another pump.
30:48.6 Mm. Um, typically when we're gut sucking or, or, or we're not breathing deep, uh, we never really engage the diaphragm. I know it can move, it moves around one centimeter for most people, but it can move 10 centimeters. Um, and move massages, all these different things. But when we engage the diaphragm, the cardiologist, cardiologist was saying, um, if you do coherence breathing for, um, 20 minutes a day for six months, you can relate, you can reverse the age of your heart by a decade. Oh, wow. And so the way I've interpreted that is by taking some pressure off our heart, by engaging our diaphragm properly, the heart isn't having to overwork.
31:24.2 Yeah. Um, so let's give that heart some space by doing some diaphragmatic breathing because I, and this is a big thing I teach a lot is, you know, we live in very different lives to our hunter-gatherer ancestors that were sprinting, digging, playing, touching the earth, you know, um, making fires in, in, in, in groups, you know. A lot of love, a lot of connection, a lot of things going on and, and me, I sit at this desk a lot in artificial light, and I eat soft foods, and, um, chronic stress and all these different things. And, um, even recently just learning that just by in, being in a seated position, we are impeding the diaphragm a bit, you know- Yeah ...
32:00.9 as opposed to standing. Yeah. And so all these things are working against us, but the beautiful thing is once we know that, we can start to unpick it, and that is really where I spend a lot of my time is like, how can I be healthy, and how can I help clients to be healthy and breathe better despite all of the things that are going on around us right now? So I've got like an earthing mat here. Got my, you know, got my light blocking glasses. Yeah. Got a red light therapy device. You know, I have massage. I do breathwork. So I'm constantly look- I, you know, touch the, the ground outside, like I daylight my eyes first thing.
32:33.9 So although I'm p- the breath, the breath guy looking at breathwork a lot, um, I really try and take that, um, that holistic view to health as much as possible and go, "What's free or nearly free that I can do that's gonna unpick some of the modern issues- Mm-hmm ... that we're experiencing?" It's really interesting that, you know, the diaphragm, you know, its location, its movement Uh, you know, the inspiratory and expiratory muscles, you know, or the pro- the strength and flexibility of these muscles actually protect the heart from going into these hyper states of, you know, hyperventilation or really high levels of blood pressure and, uh, you know, heart fibrillation.
33:15.9 So it's almost like we're retraining the brain that when we sense a higher heart rate, rather than just let it go up, we can stop and pause- Mm-hmm ... and we can connect with our inspiratory and expiratory muscles, and then the brain begins to see and rewires itself that when the heart rate's up, I don't have to let it get to 180. I can actually grab it at 120 and I can strengthen these muscles of inhale and exhale, and now I've got another line of defense to protect the number one organ that is dying first. I mean, heart disease is the number one killer. You know, and when you think about it, having only one motor nerve, the phrenic nerve, it, it's almost genius because you're gonna have to invest
34:03.8 some time to strengthen the electrical current or tone of this nerve. Mm. And with the diaphragm only having one motor nerve, it's gonna take time. Like, you know, like, it's not gonna happen overnight. Yeah. A lot of time. Which is great because we can't handle healing... Everybody wants to heal overnight, but it, it's not realistic. Yeah. You know? I mean, it comes in little bits and pieces and little ahas and, you know, holding yourself erect when you used to be like this. Yes. Or maybe keeping our mouth shut when we used to talk, you know, all these little things, and it's all coming from right here.
34:42.5 Mm-hmm. And we don't even think about this being intelligent. Mm. Yeah. Takes a, takes a... It generally, you know, our decline of health generally takes a while. Not always, but generally, you know, we eat pizza every day or alcohol, or we get bad sleep. But you're right, then we want a pill to just fill in- But hang on. No, you spent three decades making yourself poorly. It's gonna take some time and patience and love to, to get back, to reverse some of that, if not all of it. So yeah, you're right. There is this, "I need to feel better right now," you know? Uh- Right.
35:17.4 And that's choice ... just, you know, I've just come out o- Yeah, yeah, choice. Yeah. Um, yeah. A decision. Yeah. But powerful, isn't it? Like decisions can take, you know, years to come to, but then everything can change in a, in a s- in a sec- second quarter once you make that decision. It's so interesting the time that we're living in where more people are saying, "I'm choosing my reality. It's not being chosen for me." Mm. Something's not quite right there. Yeah. And, you know, I don't want any part of that. Mm. And it's so interesting 'cause you have this, you know, this restart, a rebooting breath.
35:51.7 Just takes one breath to pause And sometimes that's just enough to start to rewire the brain, rewire the microbiome of the gut, where we can manage emotions and thoughts, where in the past they managed us. Yeah. Yeah. It's- And you're on the foreground of this. Yeah. A lot of responsibility. Yeah. Yeah. You know, it's interesting you mention, um, I'm a big fan of microbiome stuff. I've been a b- I was obsessed with fecal transplants years ago. I was listening to a podcast and I was like, "What the hell? They're swapping the poo around with people?" Um, but I had a guy on recently, uh, Dr.
36:29.9 James Kinross, um, who's been doing this for 20 years, and he was talking about nasal biome and lung biome. I've never heard those, those words before. Mm-hmm. Um, and he was saying nasal biome in particular he believes was a, a really good indicator on how sick you're gonna get with COVID, 'cause if you've got a really good nasal biome, it's gonna protect you from a lot of stuff. Exactly. So yeah, and then we've got nasal nitric oxide and that helps do stuff, but actually the biome's a little bit different. And so, um, I'm really trying to protect that biome now by doing things like, um, not shoving those sprays up there that decongest you.
37:03.8 Right. Not using those inhalers. Trying to be careful with the nasal hairs. Careful, like, um, even tissue, even, even tissue paper that we blow our nose with, um, is bleached. And so we've got to be really careful with some of this thing because, you know, you put a lot of chemicals up there and it starts to destroy that, and that's your first line of defense, you know? Um, you want to keep that as, as healthy as possible. So yeah, so gut biome, yeah, really interested in that, but very recently now thinking other biomes as well. Well, look how it's all connected. Mm. Healthy diaphragm. Yeah.
37:34.7 Healthy microbiome. Yeah. Nasal breathing. Strong immunity. Mm. It all makes sense when you can follow the dots. Yeah. Yeah. So yeah, the whole nose thing and, and the COVID, this is our number one line of defense of keeping airborne pollutants that we can't see out of our body. This is really not the best way. Yeah. You think about how far we're protected before it goes into our lungs, from coming through the nose, sinuses, uh, just it's amazing. And you know, it... I used to get emails from teachers of mine, and they would just be so upset that, like, it wasn't on TV. You know, like every night there'd be, you know, briefings about COVID and, you know, all this stuff in, on the news and, and nobody was ever talking about breathing through your nose.
38:30.2 Yeah. Exhaling longer than your inhale, strengthening your diaphragm, protecting your digestion. A- and these guys, some of these, these younger teachers, they can get fired up. Yeah. Yeah. No, I, I feel the same. I had a, a couple of bits I learnt from doctors during COVID which was pretty cool. Um, one was, um, that they'd learnt to put their patients on the side. When they put them on their back and they impeded the back, they couldn't take as deep breaths and people ended up on more ventilators. This is early COVID. But the minute you put somebody on their side... And it's quite interesting actually, 'cause, um, slight tangent, but whenever I go off to a breath festival and someone's doing a conscious connected breath, pretty much 99% of people, if not 100%, are
39:12.5 lying on their backs. Um, and I'll do it on the side, and I can get so much more space. It makes it so much more potent and, and powerful, so I love that. So, um, space in the back. The other thing I, I got from, from some doctors during COVID was, um, the ones that really understood the breath were going around humming during their rounds. Yeah. They were im- increasing this, this miracle nasal nitric oxide gas, which is antifungal, anti- ster- you know, sterile, um, vasodilator, makes you take a better breath. And so they knew that by just being silly and humming a little bit while they're walking around the hospital, they were giving themselves a lot more protection against this, uh, this virus, which is pretty cool.
39:50.7 It, it's nature's way of ear, nose, throat. Mm. When you vibrate here, ear, nose, throat, you get this amazing cleansing and, you know, who would've thunk? But that's how the ancients were doing it. Yeah. And it has this amazing effect on focus, which is also really... 'Cause everything works on suction and pressure. Mm. Yeah, you, gosh, man, you've got so many pearls of wisdom, Mike, with these ama- well, you already have them in your own, but these guests that you have, like, this is gold. Yeah. Yeah. It's, it's, it's, it... I, I, every time I do a podcast I get something. Every single time. And, um, I, I...
40:31.1 'Cause at some point, I mean, I mem- when I started this I thought, "I'll just do 10 interviews." And the same with you. You know, you've done so many of these. Um, and I thought, "You know what? Probably 10 and that'll probably cover everything." And then, yeah, I did the ninth, and I was like 10th, and I thought, "I'll do one more." And the 11th one blew my mind, and we're up to about 84 now, something like that. And so, and there's no signs of stopping. I've just got a, we've actually got a huge list now of people that we're trying to get on. So, um, and this is where I'm, this is where I'm, I'm, um, taking a little bit of a left turn, ti- tiny bit, is what I've noticed with a lot of people, clients, potential
41:06.3 clients, people on, uh, my YouTube or my email list, is they know a lot of these exercises now because they're out there, but the big thing that's holding them back is habits and consistency. Mm. And so I'm trying to get on some habits experts now. Um, some people that talk about grit. Um, people that set up their days properly. Because I feel like there's this whole bit of breathwork that we're not really talking about too much, which is like, okay, so I can nasal breathe, I can do diaphragmatic breathing, um, and, and I know the importance, but I haven't really gone down the reason why for me personally.
41:39.6 I haven't done the deep work on myself as b- uh, as to why, and/or my lifestyle is so busy, how the hell am I gonna get time to do all these exercises? So this is the new area I'm getting very excited about, is like how I help people, um, really build long-lasting habits, because I feel like if you can combine great habits, um- And grit with potent breathing exercises, that's like a really good recipe for success. And I feel like almost- Mm ... half the story is missing at the minute. 'Cause like, you know, again, we're, we, we live in a, a information age. I can learn almost anything on the internet now, but do I apply it?
42:15.6 And, uh, I'll give you a good example of this, uh or, or- Mm ... or a very sad example of this. I started watching some of these reels, 'cause I make, I make reels, I make TikToks, you know. And so I thought, "Oh, I'll see what other people are doing." And you get into what's called a scroll hole. Mm. Um, and you end up just scrolling. And sometimes I'll just do 20 minutes, and I'll go, "Okay, let's test myself here. What did I just watch? Let's try and remember it." Maybe three things. So it's like, what have you just done for those 20 minutes? What has that changed?
42:43.9 It's not like reading a book. Um, so we live in a, we live in a junk information age as well. So yeah, this is just a bit... I'm, I'm going off on a bit of a tangent here, but I'm just thinking like how can I help people truly transform? And I feel like the habits is like a big part of that. So that's just, yeah, that's my next little mission is how to, how to accomplish that and share that with people in an easy way. Well, I love what you said earlier about your clients and how each one of them, you give a different practice to.
43:13.5 Mm. Like, I think that is genius. I think it is so important that it's not one size fits all, that we do have enough tools in our toolbox so that, number one, we don't do any harm. Mm. And really tuning in to allowing the client or the patient, you know, to figure it out on their own. You know, they, they, they wanna fix it on their own even though they come to us for help. Mm. And, you know, having the skillsets that you have and, you know, having j- what, what you just said of just, you know, everybody's different. Mm. And having that Swiss Army knife of breath, bravo, buddy.
43:50.3 Thank you. Yeah, it's, it was a, it was, um, a steady evolution. So initially I was teaching one modality, then I was doing a video course. Um, and then someone came to me and asked me for something else. I was like, "Oh, I don't know about that. Let me do some research into it." And then I had some guests on about it and, and then now it's like, okay, I've got the experience of 83, 84 podcasts to draw upon now. I've had all these... I've been, I've been to a breath university where, you know, I've learnt from people like you. Um, and I draw upon all of those, and I remember the best bits, and I put them into the, into the lessons.
44:22.4 Um, and it's more fun that way as well. You know, if I was, I think if I was teaching the same thing over and over again, I'd go a little bit crazy. But because each person's unique and they've got their own journey, and I've got, you know, I've got one client right now, and she's just really struggling. So we, we can only... She can only do a couple of minutes of breathing a day. Really struggling. Got another one who's just flying, and she's, like, leaving me little... 'Cause, uh, I offer accountability as well as part of my package. So they get my WhatsApp. So we're, we're on voice notes throughout the week.
44:49.0 Mm-hmm. Um, sending little notes back and forth, maybe a little video of an exercise guys. The other ones leave me, you know, five-minute updates telling me how they've done all the exercises, they're feeling fantastic, never felt this good and they've never slept this well. Uh, their relationships have got better. They're more concentrated. And so there's, uh, but each one requires a different part of me, um, which is lovely. Um, but that's why I can only take on a, a few. I couldn't handle 20 people a month like this because, um, they are, um, from my perspective, a little bit intense in terms of I need to build the workout for them, I need to be there for them.
45:21.2 Sometimes they need, like, an emergency session where we jump on. Um, but it's, it's lovely. It's, it's, it, it ... I feel like, I feel so privileged I get to do this for a job. And like, so I spent two decades in the corporate space doing, working energy of all things, destroying the planet, um, for a profit. Um, middle manager. Nobody below me wanted to work there. They all hated it. People above me, uh, were, were only interested in getting promoted. The customers were really unhappy, and you sit in the middle as, like, a middle manager just getting, you know, not a lot of niceness from all those different groups.
45:54.2 Yeah. So very stressful job. Um, and it's this thing a bit like, um, the postal service. Your work is never done. So, you know, if you're, if you're a gardener or a landscaper and you get a project and you finish that project and you move on- Mm ... there's something very nice about that. You're working with your hands. There's a finite time, and it's done. But I think one of the problems we have in the corporate space now is it work, that work is never done, and I think that messes with our brains. It's just, it's just ... And, and what happens is the more, going off on a little bit of a rant here, the more that we get technologically savvy, so AI is out there now, um, what's always promised is more
46:30.9 space and relaxation, but the opposite's true. You just have to- Yeah ... your, your output increases. So I, when I very first started, you know, we were using old computers and, and some ... And we were actually using faxes back in 2004. So, so I would be, customers would be faxing me their credit card details. I'd pass them to the lady who'd put it into the system. Um, now it's all automated, but no one got any time back. They didn't say, "Oh, you can now have half a day off now this week because we're so efficient." Oh, no, they just give you more, more work to do.
46:57.7 So, um, yeah, I feel very, very lucky that I get to work with these clients and create these bespoke packages, and I'm, like, so grateful. Uh, but I'm also so grateful for those two decades in the office space because it gave me a lot of empathy for people. There's a lot of people that are still there. I learnt a lot. I learnt how to talk, how to communicate. I learnt how to film. I did videos for the production, um, for the corporates. I learnt sales. I learnt marketing. I learnt customer services. So it's not all demonized. Um, but I do think it's only a certain kind of person can thrive in that corporate space, and I think it's a very small percentage of people, and I think the vast majority of
47:36.1 people are ... got some dissatisfaction, I think we spoke about as the start. You know, a lot of people are very unhappy, and they, you know, I think in the US, I don't know the UK one, but I heard in the US I think it's something like 80% of people don't like their job, which is tragic. You know, they get up every day. Um, so yeah. Yeah. So just closing that off, um, I love doing the bespoke coaching. It's, it's a, it's a real privilege. Yeah, waking up. Everybody's waking up. Yeah. And there's not an equal exchange of energy. You know- No ... that, that's not gonna be good.
48:07.1 Mm-mm. And it, it's like everybody is pissed off because it's like you're used to getting up at 7:00 in the morning, and somebody comes in and wakes you up at 5:30, and you know how you are when you're used to getting up at 7:00 and somebody comes in at 5:30. You're like, "Get out of my room." Mm. But it's like we're all being called to wake up, and I don't really know how it's gonna shake out, but I think it's gonna be a really good ending. I hope so. I, I have some positivity, but I also have some negativity towards it, and so I, I like to, I like to try and lean to the glass half full approach.
48:46.8 But, um, yeah, there seems to be a lot of bad people out there as well, isn't there? There's a lot of bad players, but there's a lot of good ... You know, I've done a lot of travel. I've been really lucky to get all over the place. Um, you know, you think, "Oh, my God, what's this country gonna be like, or this one? Or I've heard dodgy things about what they do to tourists there," and I never had a problem. I, I, I was ... I had my little laptop with me and I, I went traveling for a year and I was like, I already accepted it was gonna get stolen.
49:13.5 I did not have one thing stolen. We were traveling for 12 months. Nothing got stolen from me. Only generosity and kindness. And so people are good. People are good. So there's a few bad players, but generally people are very good I think. But, um, you know, I still have a concern about where we're potentially heading. Yeah, I get it. But, you know, when, when you're around 10 negative people and you have one person of light, it's the one person of light who runs that room. Mm. It's really interesting, the power of positivity. Yeah. Remaining silent, letting things go, you know, being around all sorts of drama and just letting it pass through you like you're a screen door.
49:58.0 You know, 'cause we- we've gotta control our inner environment. You know, we can't be drawn into everything that's taking place and- Mm ... you know, in the corp- You said something earlier. It's, it's really interesting about the brain. The brain loves to get things done. Mm. And in the corporate setting today, it's never done. It's like, it's like having a nightstand. You've got 50 books that you've read, like, 90% of it, but you haven't finished it. And a lot of this taking place during the day is what's destroying our sleep cycle- Mm ... because the brain is designed to complete, finish, pause, start again. Mm.
50:41.2 And if you have a constant influx of, you know, other people and emails and to-do lists, you're balancing ... Everybody's different, but everybody has the same brain. Mm. Everybody's brain is designed to bring things to completion- Mm ... upon starting. And it's really disturbing to kind of the animal part of the brain that thinks we're It thinks we're in danger. I'm so sorry. Give me two- No, I love this. Give me, give me two seconds, Ad. While I just turn this little fella off. Take your time. Shh. That's great. So we'll just take a couple deep breaths. We'll stay centered and know that that dog is bringing whatever he started to completion.
51:37.4 She's a good dog. She's a guard dog, and we have a lot of neighbors and a lot of noises outside and fireworks, and so she's just trying to be a protector, and I have to remember that sometimes 'cause it's like she's just, she's doing nothing wrong. She's just trying to save our lives, bless her. She does it well. She's a good dog, yeah. But when your baby's asleep next, in the next room, you're like, "Please be quiet." God's with you, Mike, I'm sure. Thank you. Yeah. What, what's next in your career? Ooh, you know, this is a good time to ask that, actually, 'cause I did some strategy.
52:15.6 This is my corporate brain kicking in. So there's some strategy. So, um, I've got, you know, I've got, I've got some ambitions. I really want to, I really want to dedicate the rest of my life to this. So this isn't, this isn't a quick thing. And so I think about old, older Mike, who's gray with a big beard, who has got a lot of knowledge and wisdom, and so I'm trying to do right by him by continuing to be a student of the breath, um, learning different modalities, practicing them, teaching them. Um, so that's, that's kind of the ul- And I, and I really want to be in a place where I've got...
52:56.0 The dream scenario would be to be in a re- my own retreat center somewhere with a bit of sunshine, uh, with a yoga place and people come... You know, people come there and focus on health and wellness. That's, that's kind of the, that's where I'm trying to get to. It's the first time I've mentioned that out loud, actually. So that's, uh, or in, in public sphere. So that's where we're trying to get to. So, so right now it's just about, um, making sure I pay the bills 'cause, uh, it's just me working now 'cause Nina's looking after our little one, uh, which is cool. Um, so just working with clients still, um, building the YouTube channel and, um, gonna be looking at a membership program
53:38.6 next year, like a very low-ticket membership program for people that wanna join. Um, a couple of other projects underway as well. So yeah, so there, there's a lot of exciting things that are happening, um, that we're just, just- In the very early stages of planning at the minute. Um, it's, uh, I, I teach some instructor training for another school for the Oxygen Advantage, so, um, people that want to be a breathwork instructor can train with me. Um, so yeah, a few bits. I, I had to really spend a lot of time at the start of this year stopping some of those plates from spinning because there was just too many, and I was like, "I'm gonna get burnt out." So I really cut it right down to, like, two or three things.
54:15.1 Um, the other thing I should probably mention is Airheads, uh, which is wonderful collaboration with, with Tom Granger. Um- Yeah ... and I kind of describe that like a breathwork events company. So we get, you know, wonderful people like you to come on board and, and, uh, we put on, like, an event and sell some tickets, and people come for, like, a two-day online seminar or something like that. So, um, we're taking a little pause now till about May, and then we're gonna come back strong in May 'cause we've both got our respective projects. But yeah, I think overall it's just, it's just working with the breath.
54:45.6 I don't do anything else. This is my main job now, uh, working with clients, continuing to put the free content, content on YouTube, which I love to do. Um, and yeah, just trying to scale now, just trying to scale and, and yeah, bring in the money to cover the costs and just live life and be a good dad. That's the, that's the number one priority now is how can I be a role model and a good dad? Nothing else really matters after that, so yeah, staying, staying grounded. Yeah, breathing into that. But that is a ... You'll be at the end of the ride someday going, "Boy, I lived my life." And don't we all want that?
55:22.3 Yeah. You know, and figuring that out at a young age, it's a gift. Great gift. Mm-hmm. Mm. So let's talk about habits. These, these ... We're habitual creatures, you know, and how can we as, as breath facilitators, what are some things that, that we can do with folks, Mike, that we can start to evolve our habitual mind into something that's more open and congruent with the bigger picture of what we can feel that's coming to us on earth right now? Mm. So I can, I can talk about what I do and what I've implemented- That's right ... with some clients. Which, so this is, this is, like, anecdotal, but that's worked on me.
56:13.3 Um, and I've tried so many morning routines, bloody hell, so many nighttime routines, and some stick, some don't, and I've tried all the apps and blah. Yeah. So, um, there is a book called Atomic Habits by James Clear. I think it might be the number one most sold book in the world nonfiction, self-help book. It's incredible. I highly recommend people get it. Thank you. The audiobook is like an online course you would happily pay 10 grand for. The value in that book is shocking. Um, and I really like the idea of just spending your time focused on one habit at a time. Because if you're like me, like, "Oh, I'm gonna, I'm gonna do cold shower, and I'm gonna go and get daylight and ground.
56:54.0 I need to meditate for 20 minutes. I'm gonna, uh, fast and have a black coffee, and then I'm gonna do my Bulletproof, and then I'm gonna do 10 press-ups, and then bla, bla, bla, and then I need to journal. And after I've journaled, I'm gonna do another cold bath." And, you know, and you build this routine, and you fail one day, and you feel terrible, and you get the shame and the guilt we spoke about at the start. And so, um, what I really like, there's a couple of bits from, uh, from the habits from that book. One is just, just do one habit and let's get that going.
57:18.6 Know your why. Why do I want to do that one habit? Not have a cold shower. Why do I want a hot, a cold shower? Well, it's meant to be good for me. No, no, go deeper. Why do you want it to be good for you? Well, I wanna feel better. Okay, so how do you feel? I don't feel very good right now. And why is it important to feel better? 'Cause I can show up for my family better. Okay, why is that important? 'Cause I wanna be remembered as a good dad. And keep going. You know, go, go, and if, uh ... So get your why, do your one habit, and then this is the genius.
57:43.0 This, this, this has never failed me, and when I implement it with clients, you know, you say, "Oh, let's go and, uh, I don't know, um, let's go to the gym and I'll make that my habit." I can't be bothered to go to the gym today, I'm tired. So you just go and do one minute. Get your gym kit on. It's gonna sound mental. You're gonna go to the gym or you're gonna go for a run. Just do 60 seconds and then stop. Right. Now, one of two things is gonna happen. You'll stop at 60 seconds and go, "Okay, that wasn't too bad. Maybe I'll do two minutes tomorrow." Or what's also most likely gonna happen is go, "Do you know what?
58:16.7 I'm already running for 60 seconds, I might as well just carry on a little bit now." And you end up doing your workout. So it's, it's, it's having this, like, mental jujitsu with your mind a little bit. Um, keep it simple, know your why, um, uh, and make the path to resistance so light and so easy, it's effortless. So of course I'm gonna go for a 60 second run. Why wouldn't I do a 60 second run? Um, and then I'm just gonna add on one last thing. I've got this from Arnold Schwarzenegger from his new book, Be Useful, which by the way, incredible. I'm gonna go back and re-listen to it.
58:44.6 It's like a man that's been so suc- I mean, you know, think whatever you, what you will politically, but think of this man who, uh, conquered the, the physical world, you know, Mr. Universe seven times, conquered the movie world, highest paid movie star, you know, most successful guy, you know, all this sort of stuff, and then became governor of, of, of California, you know. Um, and yes, there's controversies there and all the rest of it, but this guy who's now 76 is now giving back, and he's giving you these life lessons and stuff. Um, and he's talking about be useful, um, make sure that you contribute.
59:18.3 And, um, he breaks down habits and he says, "You know what? You should work out every day, but the m- don't think about it, just do it." And I was like, "Oh, oh," and I thought about it, which is the irony. And I was like, he's right, because the minute I wake up and I go, "Oh, I'm a bit achy today. I'm a bit tired. I probably deserve a cup of coffee. Let's not work out," y- y- you're already losing the battle. So it's almost like, no, no, I've made an agreement with myself to just do. And I have, um, I have a coach called Judy May, who's a wonderful human being.
59:46.7 She coaches me on life, life and, and other things. And, um, she said success is- Making commitments when you feel like it and doing them when you don't. Right. I was like, "Oof." So I'm like, "Tomorrow morning, I'm gonna get up and I'm gonna, I'm gonna work out." Then you wake up in the morning, "Oh, I can't be bothered. I feel tired." Well, that's not success 'cause yesterday you made a promise to yourself, and today you didn't do it. Right. And so I think it's, it's this thing around if I'm gonna make... If I'm gonna say something when I feel good, the success is doing it when I don't, I don't feel good.
60:22.6 And I just... And, and last bit on this, I just heard an Andrew Huberman podcast, and he's identified a region of the brain that grows when we do things we don't like to do. So if you enjoy working out, you, this part of the brain won't grow. But if you hate working out and you force yourself to do it, this part of the brain's gonna grow. And he talks about seniors and how their brains shrink, and he said the vast majority of that shrink comes from this specific region of the brain. And what happens is we just don't do enough things we don't like to do.
60:51.0 And so, um, it's finding those things that are good for us that we don't really want to do and making ourselves do it, and in doing so, we increase our self-respect, um, our love for ourselves, and we grow our brain as well. So that's a bit of a long answer, Ed, but they're, they're, they're just some of the wisdoms and nuggets that I talk about how to form, like, a habit. That is just so deep. You know, folks, play the last five minutes back. You wanna hear that twice. That was some real gold right there, Mike. You know, Ed, I tell folks, you know, "If you're not happy, lower your goals." Doesn't mean quit, but, you know, be happy.
61:28.6 You know, find s- find a level of participation in life, you know, that's acceptable to you. You know, everybody's different. You know, we all want the same thing. Mm. You know, we wanna feel some self-esteem, some self-confidence, you know, that we have a seat at the table where the choices are being made, you know? And if we can just get that, I think that's, uh, that's better than society, you know, 100 years ago. Yeah. You know, I think we're living the life of kings, you know, 500 years ago. Yeah. And it's a choice. And just being grateful and having people like you out there really shows folks a, a lantern that's lit well
62:17.7 to live a life filled with gratitude. Thank you so much, Mike, for, for joining us. There'll be a whole bunch of information on the show notes below where you guys can get ahold of Mike. And if, if you ever get a, get a chance to see him, he, he, he's one of the best people you'll ever meet in your life. He really cares about humanity. Thank you so much, Mike, for being with us. Thank you for the invite. It's been a, always a pleasure talking to you, Ed. I, I had a great time, so, um, yeah, thank you. You're the best, buddy. Cheers, buddy. If I'm gonna say something when I feel good, the success is doing it when I don't, I don't feel good.
60:22.6 And I just... And, and last bit on this, I just heard an Andrew Huberman podcast, and he's identified a region of the brain that grows when we do things we don't like to do. So if you enjoy working out, you, this part of the brain won't grow. But if you hate working out and you force yourself to do it, this part of the brain's gonna grow. And he talks about seniors and how their brains shrink, and he said the vast majority of that shrink comes from this specific region of the brain. And what happens is we just don't do enough things we don't like to do.
60:51.0 And so, um, it's finding those things that are good for us that we don't really want to do and making ourselves do it, and in doing so, we increase our self-respect, um, our love for ourselves, and we grow our brain as well. So that's a bit of a long answer, Ed, but they're, they're, they're just some of the wisdoms and nuggets that I talk about how to form, like, a habit. That is just so deep. You know, folks, play the last five minutes back. You wanna hear that twice. That was some real gold right there, Mike. You know, Ed, I tell folks, you know, "If you're not happy, lower your goals." Doesn't mean quit, but, you know, be happy.
61:28.6 You know, find s- find a level of participation in life, you know, that's acceptable to you. You know, everybody's different. You know, we all want the same thing. Mm. You know, we wanna feel some self-esteem, some self-confidence, you know, that we have a seat at the table where the choices are being made, you know? And if we can just get that, I think that's, uh, that's better than society, you know, 100 years ago. Yeah. You know, I think we're living the life of kings, you know, 500 years ago. Yeah. And it's a choice. And just being grateful and having people like you out there really shows folks a, a lantern that's lit well
62:17.7 to live a life filled with gratitude. Thank you so much, Mike, for, for joining us. There'll be a whole bunch of information on the show notes below where you guys can get ahold of Mike. And if, if you ever get a, get a chance to see him, he, he, he's one of the best people you'll ever meet in your life. He really cares about humanity. Thank you so much, Mike, for being with us. Thank you for the invite. It's been a, always a pleasure talking to you, Ed. I, I had a great time, so, um, yeah, thank you. You're the best, buddy. Cheers, buddy.